Meetings 23 March 2008

From 4freedom

The 23 March 2008 meeting 4 Freedom

Our 8th meeting, sunday 23-3-2008
[14:00] Grunt Ultsch: Well, it's meeting time
[14:00] Alexise Stransky: where is Cath?
[14:00] Melch Savon: Back
[14:00] Grunt Ultsch: Cath has some IRL gourmet night
[14:00] Grunt Ultsch: She wont be here tonite
[14:00] Alexise Stransky: i see
[14:00] Alexise Stransky: ok
[14:01] Samira Kirax: we are jalouse ;-)
[14:01] Grunt Ultsch: I am not
[14:01] Wolfear Clawtooth: I got an email addy put on the page now
[14:01] Grunt Ultsch: cool, wolfear
[14:02] Wolfear Clawtooth: i really wanted to make the Weds meeting, but couldn't for the life of me figure out what time 00:00 was
[14:02] Alexise Stransky: so, what is question of the day?
[14:02] Grunt Ultsch: Cath asked me to be the chairman today, I hope you dont mind
[14:02] Melch Savon: Go for it Grunt
[14:03] Grunt Ultsch: Well, there is no major point, but yet there are a few
[14:03] Wolfear Clawtooth: One thing I need to know: I cannot build IRC server right now due to some HW issues.....
[14:03] Wolfear Clawtooth: however, I can use FReenode
[14:03] Grunt Ultsch: Ok, let's start the IRC thing
[14:03] Grunt Ultsch: good
[14:03] Alexise Stransky: i can set up temporary server
[14:03] Wolfear Clawtooth: does anyone have an issue with me regersting as the spokeman for the group initially and we can add more later?
[14:03] Alexise Stransky: but i have laggy channel =(
[14:04] Wolfear Clawtooth: oops..meant "contact"
[14:04] Grunt Ultsch: So what wwould you suggest, wolfear? Freenode or your own?
[14:04] Wolfear Clawtooth: right now, I think Freenode until I get a new PSU. If freenode work, we can sticxk with it
[14:04] Grunt Ultsch: fine with me
[14:05] Wolfear Clawtooth: I just didn't want to initiate the group registration without checking with the group first
[14:05] Grunt Ultsch: With spokesman you mean operator?
[14:05] Wolfear Clawtooth: well..more as the contact person..we can OP whoeverneeds it
[14:06] Grunt Ultsch: but on IRC the operators are the contact persons, arent they?
[14:07] Wolfear Clawtooth: not necesaarily, to my understanding. WE can add contacts and OP as needed if I understood the info correctly
[14:08] Wolfear Clawtooth: The important ones would be the channel Moderators....we should only rarley need to OP
[14:08] Grunt Ultsch: If you say so, as far as I know you have on every IRC channel either operators or guests or members
[14:08] Rover Smit is Offline
[14:09] Grunt Ultsch: Not sure if it will get busy on IRC, I think many ppl just stick to SL
[14:09] Wolfear Clawtooth: it's just an additional way to keep in touch when SL is not an option.
[14:10] Wolfear Clawtooth: since it is available 24/7
[14:10] Grunt Ultsch: Could you give an example?
[14:10] Wolfear Clawtooth: informal meeting would be a good one....a meeting in IRC could be held of a longer period as Q&A wouldn't be limited only to time logged into SL
[14:11] Rover Smit is Online
[14:11] Grunt Ultsch: You mean you dont get kicked out when idling?
[14:12] Wolfear Clawtooth: not to my knowledge. As long as the channel is open, i think everything sho9uld remain
[14:12] Grunt Ultsch: You are right, on IRC you can idle forever, but it depends on the server
[14:13] Wolfear Clawtooth: that is one good thing with FReenode. Since it is a network, we should not encounter many problems
[14:13] Grunt Ultsch: Maybe it's a good idea to publish the advantages of an 4freedom channel on IRC on the wiki
[14:14] Grunt Ultsch: Let's move to the next issue
[14:14] Wolfear Clawtooth: ok..I can do that.
[14:14] Grunt Ultsch: great Wolfear
[14:14] Grunt Ultsch: The next issue has also to do with wolfear, it's about clarifying our goals
[14:15] Grunt Ultsch: He brought the subject up on the wiki, but he didn't allow us to edit the page ;)
[14:16] Wolfear Clawtooth: my bad..sorry. I thought it would be simpler to have idea placed on the discussion page rather than mass editing of the rough draft of the mission statement
[14:16] Grunt Ultsch: I understand, and I think that it is a good idea. But in that case we should have a discussion page.
[14:17] Wolfear Clawtooth: i have one set up. I thought it was publically accessible.
[14:17] Wolfear Clawtooth: I'm not good with wiki's
[14:17] Grunt Ultsch: I can set up one
[14:17] Grunt Ultsch: And I will
[14:18] Grunt Ultsch: In general I think that the wiki is an excellent platform to discuss
[14:18] Grunt Ultsch: It has several advantages compared to a meeting
[14:19] Wolfear Clawtooth: right..i agree..i'm just not good them
[14:19] Wolfear Clawtooth: if I can getthis to paster: here is the discussion page I set up:
[14:19] Wolfear Clawtooth: http://4freedom.a.wiki-site.com/index.php/User_talk:Wolfear
[14:20] Grunt Ultsch: You don't need to know much to deit the wiki. You don't need to know how to create a new page for example. The most important thing is that you know how to edit the existing discussion pages
[14:21] Wolfear Clawtooth: i was using my user pages...was that incorrect?
[14:22] Grunt Ultsch: I think you can use your user/talk pages for discussion, but it seems to me that you might as well allow others to edit them.
[14:22] Wolfear Clawtooth: ok..duh..i think i see what you are saying
[14:22] Grunt Ultsch: Otherwise there wouldnt be much of a discussion :)
[14:23] Wolfear Clawtooth: gotcha...my bad.
[14:23] Hack Bashly is Online
[14:23] Grunt Ultsch: I wouldnt say that. I understand that you dont want to see your whole page changed completely
[14:24] Alexise Stransky: so?
[14:24] Grunt Ultsch: But with editing the discussion page I am thinking of adding comments at the end of it, not editing the original text
[14:25] Wolfear Clawtooth: wasn't so much worried aboue page being changed as too many to the rought draft would get confusing. I'm open to whatever is best.
[14:25] Grunt Ultsch: Well, I think if you remove your request not to edit the text, everything will work out fine :)
[14:25] Melch Savon wonders why an organization dedicated to software freedom resides in a world run on proprietary software? Should this be considered an embassy?
[14:26] Alexise Stransky: aaargh i need Xserver built under uclibc =(
[14:27] Wolfear Clawtooth: i thought the Linux was open source
[14:27] Grunt Ultsch: You mean the server side, Melch?
[14:27] Melch Savon: Linden Labs Servers are not was my thought
[14:27] Hack Bashly is Offline
[14:27] Melch Savon: Mostly because I don't want to buy an island I am going to look at OpenSim again. Maybe it is usuable now.
[14:28] Grunt Ultsch: At the moment SL client side is free (GPL-ed) and the server side is not, but there is not much we can do about that
[14:28] Alexise Stransky: i have private opensim server
[14:28] Alexise Stransky: it unusable for now
[14:28] Hack Bashly is Online
[14:28] Alexise Stransky: having soooooo many bugz
[14:28] Grunt Ultsch: pity
[14:28] Melch Savon: Oh there goes my dream of setting up a public server. Never mind.
[14:29] Grunt Ultsch: I'd love to log in to a free SL server
[14:29] Alexise Stransky: i
[14:29] Alexise Stransky: i am too =(
[14:29] Melch Savon: I will see if I can get it running locally tonight
[14:29] Alexise Stransky: but no way for now
[14:30] Samira Kirax: I guess we'd all love...we need time & human resource...no? & patience :-)
[14:30] Alexise Stransky: phys engine is laggy, no groups....
[14:30] Grunt Ultsch: true samira :)
[14:30] Alexise Stransky: yep u're true
[14:30] Melch Savon: There is OpenSim and there is Wonderland. I hear Wonderland is good, but then you are tied into Sun Microsystems :)
[14:31] Melch Savon: Oh, and Croquet for Smalltalk lovers
[14:31] Melch Savon: But I am off topic - sorry
[14:31] Grunt Ultsch: At the moment there is no topic :) Time for a new one
[14:32] Wolfear Clawtooth: to add a "comments" section to page, so I just put a new section on my user page?
[14:32] Melch Savon starts to boot a virtual machine to do a subversion checkout of opensim. Pay him no mind.
[14:32] Grunt Ultsch: good idea, Wolfear
[14:32] Wolfear Clawtooth: k
[14:32] Kalilah Beck is Online
[14:32] Grunt Ultsch: You can do it on your wolfear/talk page, can't you?
[14:33] Grunt Ultsch: Anyway, I am very aware about the importance to publish a more detailed 'manifesto' about our group so that everyone knows clearly what we are about
[14:33] Gennady Markstein: Hi Hacker
[14:34] Melch Savon: Hey Hacker
[14:34] hakercrakercroketor Alter: hi. sorry for the delay
[14:34] Samira Kirax: hi
[14:34] Rover Smit: hi haker
[14:34] Grunt Ultsch: Hi craker, hope you don't mind that we already started?
[14:34] Wolfear Clawtooth: i added a "comments section at the end of my user page
[14:34] hakercrakercroketor Alter: not atl all, sorry grunt
[14:35] hakercrakercroketor Alter: 3 days out i have return and ready
[14:35] Grunt Ultsch: good, wolfear, I'll make use of it
[14:35] Wolfear Clawtooth: also edieted to other section to reflect using the comments instead of discussion page.
[14:36] Kalilah Beck is Offline
[14:36] Wolfear Clawtooth: as an aise, I was playing around the other nite and got a wild hair to test out some software
[14:36] Wolfear Clawtooth: *aside
[14:36] Grunt Ultsch: Well, I'll check it later, on with meeting now
[14:37] Grunt Ultsch: Our group is growing fast, and we very much want more land.
[14:38] Grunt Ultsch: We will get that when the isle is ready
[14:38] Grunt Ultsch: the new isle I mean
[14:38] Grunt Ultsch: unfortunately I don't know if there are any new developments
[14:38] Wolfear Clawtooth: can we expect a donation box for group expanses such as land anytime in the near future?
[14:39] Wolfear Clawtooth: *expenses
[14:39] Grunt Ultsch: Sure, if anyone wants to build one
[14:39] Alexise Stransky: just give me many prims.....
[14:39] Grunt Ultsch: I don't have any prims :) Have you run out of 'm?
[14:40] Alexise Stransky: everytime i started to build
[14:41] Alexise Stransky: you already seen one my detailed building
[14:41] Alexise Stransky: at the ground
[14:41] Grunt Ultsch: Oh yes, another thing, I didnt check the new chairs on the isle, but please make sure to build free objects. If you don't set the permissions right, you'll immeditely get proprietary objects
[14:41] Alexise Stransky: it used 8 prims per one chair
[14:42] Alexise Stransky: hehe just tell me where i am wrong and i will fix that
[14:42] Wolfear Clawtooth: could some of the free objects be packed and a simple texture used to display what they are?..would that save some prims?
[14:42] Alexise Stransky: maybe
[14:43] Grunt Ultsch: I'll show you after the meeting, and I will also make a wiki page about how to build free objects
[14:43] Tavia Nadezda is Offline
[14:43] Alexise Stransky: i will set perms after full completion
[14:43] Alexise Stransky: if you are about that chairs
[14:43] Tavia Nadezda is Online
[14:44] Alexise Stransky: all of my complete buildings is free
[14:44] Grunt Ultsch: When we get our new island we want practically all objects there to be free
[14:45] Grunt Ultsch: good alexise, I'm happy to hear that, but it's easy to forget something.
[14:45] Alexise Stransky: nope
[14:46] Grunt Ultsch: If for example you forget to give some texture or script full permissions, the whole object will be unfree
[14:46] Alexise Stransky: i just set perms only after full completion of my idea
[14:47] Grunt Ultsch: Ok, I'll check them when they are ready
[14:48] Grunt Ultsch: By the way, if the author can freely copy it that doesnt mean others can too, so for the author it is not easy to find out if his own objects are free or not
[14:48] Alexise Stransky: hehe
[14:48] Alexise Stransky: i always set next owner can copy/modify and allow anyone to copy
[14:49] Wolfear Clawtooth: Grunt: can we post the time for the informal meeting somewhere on the WIki?...all I could find was "00:00" in the meeting log and never could determine whattime that actaully was.
[14:49] Grunt Ultsch: excellent alexise, so do I.
[14:49] Alexise Stransky: can we set meetings time at 00:00 or 01:00 not 02:00?
[14:49] Alexise Stransky: it's tooooo late
[14:50] Grunt Ultsch: Sure we can, we have a meetings page, we can publish it there
[14:50] Grunt Ultsch: what time is it over there, alexise?
[14:50] Wolfear Clawtooth: k..i have no problems working around time zones. Whatever works best for the majority is fine with me
[14:50] hakercrakercroketor Alter: here 22:50
[14:51] Samira Kirax: yep MEZ
[14:51] Alexise Stransky: here is 01:50
[14:51] Grunt Ultsch: In western Europe it is 22.50 now
[14:51] Grunt Ultsch: I see what you mean, alexise :)
[14:51] Melch Savon: I live on SL time so whatever is good for most is good for me
[14:51] Grunt Ultsch: lol melch
[14:51] Raphory Repine is Online
[14:52] Wolfear Clawtooth: I'm CST so it 16:50 here
[14:52] Melch Savon: No really :) I move to San Francisco tomorrow
[14:52] Alexise Stransky: but because of DST we have 02:50 at the end of april...
[14:52] Alexise Stransky: may i meant
[14:52] Grunt Ultsch: I think we can have our meeting next sunday one hour earlier, what do you all think?
[14:52] Alexise Stransky: blabalbala
[14:52] Melch Savon: Sure
[14:52] Alexise Stransky: March*
[14:52] hakercrakercroketor Alter: for me no prob
[14:52] Samira Kirax: is ok to me of course
[14:52] Alexise Stransky: heh
[14:53] Wolfear Clawtooth: fine with me
[14:53] Melch Savon: Just for fun I will try to find a coffee shop by Linden Labs to attend the meeting from and upload a picture
[14:53] Grunt Ultsch: ok, that's settled then
[14:53] Free and open NuclearBomb: For help on how to use this weapon , click me!
[14:53] Wolfear Clawtooth: don't forget a group announcement
[14:53] Samira Kirax: I hate DST, it saves nothing to anybody *lol*
[14:53] Alexise Stransky: yep
[14:53] Grunt Ultsch: We must think of the Russians :)
[14:53] Alexise Stransky: )))
[14:54] Samira Kirax: of course ;-)
[14:54] hakercrakercroketor Alter: si, yeah, da
[14:54] Rover Smit: =)
[14:54] Wolfear Clawtooth: lol..i was up till 2:00 am my time tryingto find the informal meeting...no problems....rofl
[14:54] Kalilah Beck is Online
[14:54] Alexise Stransky: Hak do you know russian?
[14:54] hakercrakercroketor Alter: no : (
[14:54] Melch Savon: Nyet?
[14:55] hakercrakercroketor Alter: jsut words
[14:55] hakercrakercroketor Alter: jsut
[14:55] Alexise Stransky: ahhh
[14:55] hakercrakercroketor Alter: arghh, just words
[14:55] Gennady Markstein: :)
[14:55] Rover Smit: Melch, u do?
[14:55] Grunt Ultsch: I dont know anything about informal meetings. I'm only into formal meetings
[14:55] Samira Kirax: back to "topic" ;-)?
[14:55] Wolfear Clawtooth: it was discused last week. I didn't know if anyone actaulyl showed or not
[14:56] Grunt Ultsch: I remember it was planned last wednesday, during a Champion League match... (sorry)
[14:57] Grunt Ultsch: Who actually arranges the informal meetings?
[14:57] Waiter Ronnie shouts: Not permitted to copy that inventory.
[14:57] Wolfear Clawtooth: no idea..several people were discussing it, but i do not know who the organizer would have been
[14:58] Grunt Ultsch: hmmm, looks we shouldn't expect too much of these informal meetings
[14:58] Wolfear Clawtooth: i think mainly ther were just to set up some sort of agendas for Sunday. Beyond that, I don't know
[14:59] Grunt Ultsch: Yes, I remember that too
[14:59] Samira Kirax: ...I said to make a notice or sth about...otherwise is no use?
[15:00] Grunt Ultsch: I suggest to not set up an informal meeting this week and have our formal meeting next sunday at 1.00 PM SL time, ok?
[15:00] Alexise Stransky: okaye
[15:00] Wolfear Clawtooth: sounds good to me
[15:00] Samira Kirax: ok
[15:00] Melch Savon: Seconded
[15:00] Grunt Ultsch: Well, time is up. Does anyone have a last question?
[15:01] Wolfear Clawtooth: lst thing for me:
[15:01] Wolfear Clawtooth: I know drupal is supposed to be used for web site, but I got bored the other night
[15:01] Wolfear Clawtooth: I set up an area using RavanNuke if anyone is intersted in seeing it
[15:02] Grunt Ultsch: I don't know what you are talking about
[15:02] Wolfear Clawtooth: it's another open source CMS
[15:02] Grunt Ultsch: no thanks
[15:02] Grunt Ultsch: Maybe some other time
[15:03] Wolfear Clawtooth: i was bored, no biggie.
[15:03] Grunt Ultsch: Ok, well, the meeting is closed now. Next week cath will be there
[15:03] Grunt Ultsch: Thanx for coming
[15:04] Samira Kirax: thank u
[15:04] Wolfear Clawtooth: thnx for chairing Grunt
[15:04] Gennady Markstein: thx
[15:04] Grunt Ultsch: no problem
[15:04] hakercrakercroketor Alter: yeah nice free meeting
[15:04] Wolfear Clawtooth: guess it's time for tringo now...lol
[15:04] Grunt Ultsch: Time for a smoke now
[15:05] Alexise Stransky: aahahah
[15:05] Wolfear Clawtooth: yeah..that and more coffee